RIT honors seminar, developing for the OLPC XO/03 April 2009


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Karlie Robinson attended the Seminar on 03 April 2009 and started the chat session below:

irc://irc.freenode.net#fedora-olpc edited transcript:

10:02	KarlieRobinson	good morning everyone
10:02	KarlieRobinson	we're about to get underway at RIT
10:03	KarlieRobinson	ke4qqq: ping
10:03	Nashella	Hello KarlieRobinson
10:03	FGrose	Good morning
10:03	ke4qqq	pong
10:03	ke4qqq	KarlieRobinson: pong
10:04	KarlieRobinson	hello hello
10:04	KarlieRobinson	I'm at RIT on a winvista and a crazy keyboard - please forgive typos as I'm not going to correct the
10:04	KarlieRobinson	them
10:04	KarlieRobinson	grrrr
10:05	KarlieRobinson	ke4qqq: will you be lurking this am?
10:05		*** cwickert1 joined #fedora-olpc n=chris@p508FE395.dip.t-dialin.net 
10:05		*** cwickert quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) n=chris@fedora/cwickert 
10:05	ke4qqq	I lurk all the time :)
10:05	ke4qqq	vista??? ewwww...
10:05		ke4qqq feels sorry for KarlieRobinson 
10:06	KarlieRobinson	Yeah, I'm going to have to wash my hands when I'm done
10:07		*** mib_kte4ewao joined #fedora-olpc i=81151c01@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0569d0d2f4b11258  (Mibbit)
10:07		*** cwickert1 left #fedora-olpc n=chris@p508FE395.dip.t-dialin.net 
10:08		*** tomeu joined #fedora-olpc n=tomeu@sunjammer.sugarlabs.org 
10:08	KarlieRobinson	Steve Jacobs just announced he'll be able to attend the rest of the classes
10:08	KarlieRobinson	now he wants an update on what has happened in the last few classes - especially teams and progress
10:10	KarlieRobinson	one team - competition style activities where there are winners and brackets as well as ways to eliminate issues with the same student winning all the time
10:10		*** ltl-b103 joined #fedora-olpc n=urk@ltl-10.rit.edu 
10:10	KarlieRobinson	also reporting of grades to the teacher based on performance within the software
10:11		*** ltl-b103 is now known as JamesonFinney
10:12	KarlieRobinson	students will be talking about who the audience is - since they're not RIT students
10:12	KarlieRobinson	head to head games with girls of this age bracket  is a turn-off (Jacobs)
10:13	KarlieRobinson	Girls - effort builds something together
10:16	KarlieRobinson	in the next week, the class needs to put out more ideas than we have people for.  the good ideas will gain team support, others will go to the back burner as the class concentrates on certain projects till the end of class
10:18	KarlieRobinson	students will be graded based on what they leave for the community to build upon
10:18		*** bbl5660 joined #fedora-olpc i=81151cdc@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1ac6022002ba67b3  (Mibbit)
10:19	KarlieRobinson	Team 2 - research on FunTower
10:19	KarlieRobinson	thought this would be easy to adapt
10:21	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs sounds like the first goal would be to adapt it for more complex problems and we might want to match to API and then multi-user
10:22	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs - documentation is going to be big and support materials for teachers
10:22	KarlieRobinson	No assumption that teachers will understand and we don't know what level the students are at
10:23	KarlieRobinson	Team 3 - Math Minute idea
10:23	KarlieRobinson	interest in XO networking abilities
10:24	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs - if we wanted we could combine everything we've talked about so far all against the computer or individuals
10:24	KarlieRobinson	team 4 - matching application right question to the right answer
10:25	KarlieRobinson	client server application
10:25		*** Eldrac joined #fedora-olpc i=81151c11@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bd52330d5b2de53d  (Mibbit)
10:25	KarlieRobinson	did some GUI design but they're liking the API
10:25		*** sdziallas_ joined #fedora-olpc n=sebastia@ 
10:26		*** JeremiahGreen joined #fedora-olpc i=81151c1b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-88f22d5f3738bce4  (Mibbit)
10:26	KarlieRobinson	The trick is making the API flexible enough to cover all of these applications
10:26	KarlieRobinson	team 5
10:28		*** wwdillingham joined #fedora-olpc i=81151c1a@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1388368544ce23ad  (Mibbit)
10:28	KarlieRobinson	thinking about mesh networking
10:28	KarlieRobinson	feels it's a little slow etc
10:29	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs - let's tie the mesh work with the troubles we're having with application development
10:30	KarlieRobinson	Group 6 - talking about competition flash cards game
10:30	ke4qqq	KarlieRobinson: do they know about the effective limits of mesh networking - ie the more nodes present it's slower?
10:31	KarlieRobinson	as in who's first to answer.  Time limits and aggregate scores
10:31	KarlieRobinson	Nope - but I'll pas it on for you ke4qqq
10:31	ke4qqq	I understand that around 40 nodes == unusable.
10:32	ke4qqq	but someone else is prolly omre qualied to speak to that subject
10:32	ke4qqq	qualified even
10:32	KarlieRobinson	ke4qqq: yes and we won't be beta testing on large networks
10:32	JeremiahGreen	I guess that explains why when the whole class is together the mesh networking seems to pop in and out. Machines connect then disconnect and reconnect again later.
10:33	wwdillingham	knowing this, can we break up half the class into smaller meshes?
10:33	ke4qqq	wwdillingham: honestly I don't know - I'll make a note to ask mchua though.
10:33	KarlieRobinson	School server - really cool if we have time.
10:33	JeremiahGreen	wwdillingham: would they need to connect different routers to be isolated?
10:34	ke4qqq	JeremiahGreen: the point of mesh is to do it sans routers
10:34	KarlieRobinson	must things talking to each other first - push to other applications second
10:34		*** qalthos quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) n=nate@blackmagic.rit.edu 
10:34	ke4qqq	it's peer to peer ad hoc networking of sourts
10:34	ke4qqq	sorts
10:35	KarlieRobinson	ke4qqq: looks like you're on a wonky keyboard this morning too
10:35	ke4qqq	yeah, but at least I am running linux
10:35	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs would like the class to put forth a more detailed list of what has been discovered so far
10:35	KarlieRobinson	ke4qqq: :)
10:36	wwdillingham	it would be a challenge to figure out how to determine when to inititate the multiple meshes, and who belongs to which. However with the list of mac addresses we could default the various networks. Dynamically choosing the meshes though woudl be hard
10:36		*** Qalthos joined #fedora-olpc n=nate@it-roam28-91.it.rit.edu 
10:36	ke4qqq	wish Mel was on now
10:39	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs wants the math4 delicious list to get longer
10:39	KarlieRobinson	as well as better
10:39	wwdillingham	i feel like the 11-12 posts i tagged as maths4olpc were never added to the delicious...
10:39	wwdillingham	"for:maths4olpc" rather
10:40	mib_kte4ewao	wwdillingham: it sounds like maybe eric needs to approve them first
10:41	mib_kte4ewao	wtf @ my name
10:41		*** mib_kte4ewao is now known as breen
10:41	KarlieRobinson	looking for educators to wade through the massive amount of info to get the delicious data to a more usable form
10:43		*** sdziallas quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)) n=sebastia@p57A2E733.dip.t-dialin.net 
10:43	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs - for next time - maybe an email during the week - deadline will be posted.  The group here at RIT needs to decide what they want to work on
10:43	KarlieRobinson	being specific on outcomes
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10:44		*** sdziallas_ is now known as sdziallas
10:44	KarlieRobinson	Next Friday the students will nail down what's being worked on as well as time lines and deliverables.
10:45	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs has confirmed guests to talk with the class on game and educational development
10:46	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs is also talking with Mchua about a visit to Rochester
10:47	KarlieRobinson	Now class will talk more about the applications that the students have looked at
10:47	KarlieRobinson	Talking about Wesnoth - turn based role play
10:48	KarlieRobinson	games aren't installing well on the XO
10:49	KarlieRobinson	bridge - building with blocks to create bridges - problem solving
10:49	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs - how to tie bridge to the math standards
10:53	KarlieRobinson	Next game - when games and aps in early dev stages, talk with the dev team - Good advice
10:54	wwdillingham	err, where do we signup for mailing list?
10:55	JeremiahGreen	wwdillingham: I can't tell I see a bunch on 

10:55 ke4qqq which mailing lists do you want to be on wwdillingham 10:56 KarlieRobinson visit the math4team page at sugar it's listed there

10:57 KarlieRobinson

10:57 wwdillingham ty 10:57 KarlieRobinson you can then sort it into a folder by the [math4] subject header 10:57 *** nikeunltd joined #fedora-olpc i=81151c03@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-5f1473507d24d502 (Mibbit) 10:57 nikeunltd name Kennedy_RIT 10:59 KarlieRobinson just had an open house group stop by 10:59 KarlieRobinson aka fresh meat for my FOSS master plan 11:02 KarlieRobinson the best selling game of all time is sim city - it's a spreadsheet 11:02 KarlieRobinson when thinking about applying that to other things 11:03 KarlieRobinson Localization of this type of Tycoon type games- is it a hot dog stand? Lemonade? Fish market? 11:04 *** jsgotangco quit ("Ciao") n=JSG@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco 11:04 *** nikeunltd is now known as Kennedy_rit 11:04 Kennedy_rit eric, would it be alright if i leave class early? 11:04 KarlieRobinson Eric Grace has extensive notes on games. 11:04 *** ivazquez joined #fedora-olpc n=ivazquez@fedora/ignacio 11:05 KarlieRobinson Jacobs asked that Eric Grace update his notes with what FGrose has already posted to the wiki

11:07 bbl5660 FOUND:

11:08 bbl5660 That's Fred's page on what is useful or not 11:08 Kennedy_rit awesome!

11:08 bbl5660 I'll add a link to it from the
 and Maths4OLPC wiki pages

11:08 wwdillingham do fourth graders like sudoku too? 11:09 breen wwdillingham: i hope not 11:09 wwdillingham breen: why? 11:09 Kennedy_rit wwdillingham: they should =] 11:10 breen wwdillingham: it seems a bit time consuming for the application of comparatively simple math principles 11:10 breen wwdillingham: that is, balancing a whole grid vs. underlying addition/subtraction 11:10 breen wwdillingham: then again.. maybe? 11:11 wwdillingham so its too difficult to program or the kids wouldnt like it? 11:11 breen wwdillingham: my guess is the latter 11:11 wwdillingham i actually dont think it would be too bad 11:11 breen wwdillingham: oh sorry, by time consuming i meant their use 11:11 breen wwdillingham: not development 11:11 wwdillingham especially if there is a database already of sudoku problems 11:12 breen wwdillingham: but honestly i'm not basing this on much 11:13 KarlieRobinson Wow I just had an idea - what about using tamtam applcations to explain fractions? Quarter notes whole notes etc? 11:13 wwdillingham verification of correctness would just be adding up var[x][0-9] and var[0-9][x] to make sure 1-9 was contained in all 11:14 breen wwdillingham: i agree that the *development* would be simple 11:14 wwdillingham but.. sudoku not on paper is hard 11:14 wwdillingham you need scratch paper really 11:14 breen wwdillingham: true 11:14 wwdillingham which would be the challenge i guess 11:15 wwdillingham time consuming yes but freakin fun 11:15 breen wwdillingham: actually... rows could be highlighted green when balanced 11:15 wwdillingham nice thought 11:15 breen to help indicate progress to the student 11:16 breen maybe some sort of hint mechanism if they get stuck in a quagmire 11:16 Qalthos don't forget that each square needs to be balanced as well 11:16 Qalthos in my opinion the most annoying part 11:17 *** Neablis joined #fedora-olpc n=GDDAdmin@cl1-10.it.rit.edu 11:17 breen it might be worthwhile to just use one quadrant as the entire grid 11:17 KarlieRobinson how could you play an "open air market" game as a colaboration? 11:17 breen in favor of simplicity 11:17 KarlieRobinson Who grows the lemons? Who refines the sugar? 11:17 wwdillingham yes, but i think if both rows and columns are balanced so must be the squares 11:17 KarlieRobinson how does the economy work? 11:17 wwdillingham am i wrong? probably 11:18 Qalthos not necessarily 11:18 Qalthos I think 11:18 Qalthos otherwise diagonals could contain the same number within a square 11:19 breen Qalthos: ah, there it is. seems right 11:19 Qalthos Personally, I keep confusing it with a magic square, which usually has none of the uniqueness requirements 11:20 Qalthos or if it does, you only get one of each number, at least from the ones I've done 11:20 *** Kennedy_rit quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c03@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-5f1473507d24d502 11:24 wwdillingham http://home.dlma.com/Download/sudoku/index.html 11:24 KarlieRobinson Jacobs feels that some sort of tycoon game (lemonade stand) could be something some of us could play with since it fits nicely with other forms of aid - heiffer.org, micro loans and such that are successful at uplifting village economies 11:24 KarlieRobinson Now moving on to early education discussion

11:27 KarlieRobinson we are at
http://pbs.org/parents/childdevelopmenttracker/ 11:30 KarlieRobinson http://www.pbs.org/parents/childdevelopmenttracker/eight/mathematics.html
11:33	KarlieRobinson	Jacobs asks - how much are we developing to an age, or to a math level?
11:35	KarlieRobinson	

11:35 KarlieRobinson OLPC deployment maps 11:41 KarlieRobinson Talking game development now 11:42 KarlieRobinson Core mechanics - in Mario it's Run and Jump 11:43 KarlieRobinson Start with the core mechanics - what the program will do - then what the program can do and finally, cool if we get to it features 11:43 KarlieRobinson in 6 weeks the RIT class would like to get the Core mechanics working for the math applications 11:44 KarlieRobinson by asking what is the core mechanics? In the world bank model the core mechanics is buy and sell 11:44 KarlieRobinson It's always there and it keeps getting better 11:44 *** JamesonFinney quit ("Class over.") n=urk@ltl-10.rit.edu 11:45 *** breen quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c01@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0569d0d2f4b11258 11:45 *** Eldrac quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c11@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bd52330d5b2de53d 11:46 KarlieRobinson Class is over for now - must do is for students to get on the math4 mailing list and to choose a project to begin working on. etc student centric 11:46 *** JeremiahGreen quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c1b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-88f22d5f3738bce4 11:47 *** KarlieRobinson quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c0e@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-4a49db3ec8289231 11:47 wwdillingham lets hope free lunch from this open hosue 11:48 *** wwdillingham quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151c1a@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1388368544ce23ad 11:48 *** Neablis left #fedora-olpc n=GDDAdmin@cl1-10.it.rit.edu 11:59 *** bbl5660 quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") i=81151cdc@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1ac6022002ba67b3 12:01 *** Nashella quit ("Leaving.") n=nmichel@fedora/nashella 12:02 *** Qalthos quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) n=nate@it-roam28-91.it.rit.edu

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