Talk:Bitfrost

Typos

1. I can't edit the page, but the "No permanent data loss" box has a typo: in the event that

   Fixed

Unix permissions

The author describes some version of typical Unix permissions and security model behind it and then complains that with this model "we can't stop viruses and malware" and that "anyone can send a user an executable program, and for many years the users' instinctive reaction was to open the attachment and run the program." The reality is quite different really. I use Unix systems since 15+ years. My machines were never eaten by a virus and I never have run a program directly from an attachment. The only problem with e-mail viruses is that they add to spam but it is very easy to filter viruses anyway.

If you start your design of new security model with such false assumptions your results may be still right at the end - or may be not.

I'm not the author, but I think the new security model is a pretty good idea. Sure, you or I may not have gotten viruses, but nearly every inexperienced computer user I know has gotten one. You are lucky that you know not to open attachments and that Unix is not a high target for virus writers -- because there are not many Unix machines, and most of their owners know better than to open attachments or run strange programs. But the OLPC changes this: it will bring online a huge population of inexperienced computer users. It will be a magnet for botnets and mischief-makers. It deserves a well-thought-out security system.

The benefit of the Unix permission system is that a user can only screw up their own files, not the files of other users or the operating system itself. As beneficial as this is, it is hardly a consolation to the user who has just lost all their files because they ran a program a "friend" sent them. Your solution is to advise the user never to run programs from other people, but this approach simply does not work, as we have seen with Windows. And, besides, one of the goals of OLPC is to allow its users to make new programs and share them with each other.

It sounds like the Bitfrost approach is to create a file system sandbox for each application so that it can't interfere with other applications. This seems entirely reasonable to me. After all, it's what Java, .NET, and Flash do to allow the user to run unsafe applets. Python, the main OLPC development system, doesn't have this kind of sandbox (yet), so it's a good thing if the underlying operating system can provide it. —Leejc 19:49, 7 February 2007 (EST)

One Brick per child?

"The sole purpose of these keys will be to verify the integrity of bundled software and content" - what is five years down the line, the child has got bored of Squeak etc and decides to install a different Linux distro, will the DRM brick the laptop?

Should not be a problem. The brick function looks like it is part of the XO's Linux operating system. If you replace the OS you remove the brick function. Note that you would need a developers key to replace the OS. -- tef 14:30, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Sexist Article

Author refers to user in the feminine sense (she). Why not use non-gender-specific terminology such as they and their? ~ Some user.

She is understood as s/he. 209.181.213.53 21:44, 7 February 2007 (EST)

A good way to use non-sexist language is simply to use the phrase he or she. Using he is traditional and is unfair to women, using she reads awkwardly. The German language has different words for male teacher and female teacher and so on and uses the equivalent of teachermale or teacherfemale in sentences. Reading he or she seems natural, balanced and factual. So maybe each use of she could be changed to be he or she please?

This does go rather deeper than just this particular article. As this article is an official OLPC managed page one may perhaps wonder how OLPC documentation for the children will be worded. The use of the word they as a way of referring to one person so as not to indicate gender is an unfortunate trend in English these days. It is not, however, as bad as another trend, namely using the word you to mean someone or using the word you to mean some particular organization whose responsibilities are being discussed. This produces sentences which upon analysis sound ridiculous, yet such usage happens very often in television news interviews nowadays.

I also 'dislike' the pc-emphasis on 'she'... I would prefer the explicit 's/he' which goes perfectly highlighting the gender issue, while addressing both and remaining neutral. Unlike spanish where although you could write 'el/la' (el/ella) but then has to drop neutrality in the words following—ie: el/la chico/a; el/la alumno/a; etc. --Xavi 09:00, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Sexist my ass

This is bull. I thought the "she" thing was cute, and a lady I'm hardly offended at this subtle acknowledgement of the existence of female computer users, even from the earliest days. Is anyone offended or upset here actually female? Or are you threatened males? In books on Go, it's traditional to switch between "he" and "she" when referring to the different players, can't we just as easily accept this playful switch? Get over it, dudes. - Madeleine -134.174.140.200 22:14, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Women in the 70s

"any code the user executed, she ipso facto trusted for all practical purposes."

Since when did women use computers in the 70s? ;)

Probably more than you can imagine... including the famous first real bug discovered by Grace Hopper (who amongst other things is credited for writing the first compiler). See also Women in Computing.

Thompson or Ritchie, which is the "she"?

That "she" is in a context that refers to the original UNIX developers. Were they bearded ladies? I've never seen women with grey beards before, but I guess it could happen.

Come one. If "he" is somehow offensive as sexism, then "she" must be equally so. The hypocracy is getting laid on nice and thick here. There is no excuse for this. Users of "he" at least have the excuse of using Standard English. Using "she" is obviouslyly sexist, as well as being factually incorrect.

24.110.145.57 21:25, 8 February 2007 (EST)

Legitimizing "Big Brother" and DRM

We all know that DRM is the enemy of open source projects, and is in fact tagged with "Defective by design". Why are you taking away the kid's control over their laptop on SECURITY concerns. You should know by now, if hackers want to use it, they will. Remember windows genuine advantage? Hackers cracked it too. All it did was hurt the end user.

I implore you (laptop.org) not to make the same mistake that Microsoft did. As much as I am hyped about your creation, I cannot help but feel dread as this proposed "security" idea steals control from the child, who is learning about computers through interacting with it, and giving it to an arbitrary authority who may misuse their power at any time. - Teenage system admin for Los Gatos Highschool.

We all know what now? I thought the enemy of Open Source was Closed Source. DRM is not mentioned in the article, it also does not have to be closed source

centralized storage

" Information on the laptop will be replicated to some centralized storage" OLPC is targeted at not so rich kids, do they all have internet access or are authors going to give blank cd/dvd and some stamps to send all those data from laptop to "some centralized storage"?

You don't need internet access to reach the school server, the wireless mesh will do just fine. And if that is not available (distances, obstacles, etc) you can see Motoman or UUCP for alternatives and Internet for the general outlook.

BTW, you would also need to ship some USB CD/DVD burners with the laptops... not just the stamps and blank media... --Xavi 13:52, 8 February 2007 (EST)